Survey Accurate Graphically Enhanced Systems (SAGES)
The Marriage of GIS and Land Surveying August 30, 2008
Posted by bahadirkhan in Calismalar (Studies), English.
Tags: geographical information systems, gis technologies, land surveying, Trimble Geomatics Office
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go to gbreisch.com for more information on how and why SAGES is so improtant
Too often the GIS professional and the surveyor are at odds; a hoity-toity GIS guy looks askance at a muddy-booted surveyor who wants to pin him down on accuracy and boundary issues, and the surveyor gets exasperated with the GIS guy who’s defining more parcels in an afternoon than he’ll work on in a month, but who can’t be bothered to think about metadata concerning monumentation or record survey information. Perhaps some surveyors have the sinking feeling that they missed the boat when it comes to GIS, that a new technology catering to measurement and boundary experts should really have added more to the bottom line of land surveyors than seems to be the case.
But things are changing. As GIS matures, survey grade accuracy is becoming more important and the value of a reliable boundary layer is increasingly obvious. This creates opportunities for land surveying firms, and Flatirons, Inc. of Boulder, Colorado is a good example of a company taking advantage. Flatirons (named for the Flatirons, an iconic mountain range above the city of Boulder) does “Surveying, Engineering & Geomatics” (and yes, they do list surveying before engineering). GIS design and implementation is a big part of their business, so this is a company that has had to think a lot about how surveyors and GIS types can work together. “GIS professionals aren’t currently licensed,” says J.B. Guyton, a licensed surveyor and CEO of Flatirons, “and the original authorship of GIS documents is important to surveyors. Chad and the other young guys here are helping us bring together the facts on the ground with the relevant legalities, and creating GIS boundaries that can better withstand court challenges.” `Chad’ is Chad McFadden, a senior project manager at Flatirons, who adds, “We’re both talking about the same points, after all–if we can unify this, we’ll be bringing the good things about surveying into GIS.”
A recent project for the City of Wheat Ridge, Colorado gave Flatirons the opportunity to try something new: Gather GIS data at survey grade accuracy, in one pass. If things went well, Flatirons would be able to move ahead with projects involving boundary monumentation. As Guyton says, “We’re figuring out how to marry these two disciplines, ancient and modern.”
New Tech Makes Marriage Possible
Wheat Ridge was working on a critical component of their new GIS, the storm sewer layer. The existing system wasn’t working. “They had paper map books,” explains McFadden, “but they were more wrong than right. Most of the system information seemed to be in one guy’s head, and he was too busy to update map books. So, we started to work on solutions.”
Wheat Ridge was working in concert with Jefferson County 911 program and all of the county’s cities. This made Flatirons’ job easier, as the county had standardized on ESRI software, settled on layer schemes, and worked through datum issues. “We started by converting an old storm water map to GIS. There was no metadata, and it was very inaccurate. Some points had been sketched in, some maybe surveyed, and some came from design–and there was no way to tell which was which. And it was incomplete; when we checked a few, we’d pop lids and find runs that weren’t shown.”
Obviously, new fieldwork was needed, and since the project would basically be an “as-built with a GIS deliverable,” per McFadden, the work had to be to sub-centimeter horizontal accuracy. This was new territory. GIS fieldwork requires standardized collection of a great deal of data. Gathering techniques have to be efficient and, well, easy: with more than 2,500 intakes, manholes, and outflows in Wheat Ridge, all with multiple attributes, crews would have to move fast and there wouldn’t be time to reinvent the wheel every day. By contrast, getting to sub-centimeter typically requires a certain fastidiousness, and the kind of confidence that comes with checking and rechecking. Typically, getting both types of information would take two passes–could Flatirons be fast and fastidious?
Not everyone thought so. “We came up with a method to capture all the data in one pass, at the required accuracy, and that’s what we based our bid on. There were two other bidders who said our way wouldn’t work. But with some help from Trimble, we proved them wrong.”
The help from Trimble came in two forms: a Trimble® VRS NowTM Network RTK Service, and a custom file output from Trimble Geomatics Office (TGO) software, simplifying uploading of data into the ESRI GIS.
The VRS Now Service in Colorado is the first in the nation to feature low band radio, in addition to cellular telephony, as a way to establish links with reference stations. For Devin Kowbuz, another Project Manager at Flatirons, this was a decisive advantage. “In the city, packet data takes a back seat to voice,” he explains. “This can affect our ability to stay connected.” McFadden adds, “The low band is privately owned by Trimble, and it can’t be trumped; we weren’t tied to a cell phone company, or limited by their network. The low band is good everywhere VRS Now is accurate.” Since base stations didn’t have to be set up for RTK, crews could get right to work and about an hour and a half a day was saved, versus conventional RTK. “We bid the job knowing we had the advantage of VRS Now,” says McFadden, “To hop out of the truck, grab a rod, and be surveying? That’s impressive.”
Another issue was data output. As sold, the Trimble Geomatics Office didn’t quite meet project GIS data requirements. McFadden wanted a collection process that “forced crews to gather the data,” while limiting entries to a `data dictionary’ compatible with the GIS scheme. And since 2,500 nodes with multiple attributes (such as direction, invert, composition, and pipe size) generates a lot of data, he wanted a streamlined download procedure to save office time. “I talked to Trimble, and they sent a developer right to our office who wrote us a piece of custom code for TGO that allowed us to output a single table that integrated flawlessly into the GIS.” The code also enforced the desired data collection routine and automated the lengthy collection process making it, if not easy, at least routine.
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http://gbreisch.com/gwb/ is my main menu page where you can view articles on SAGIS & SAGES for Survey Accurate (SA) and Graphically Enhanced Systems to manage Survey Monument Data related to coordinates tied into Control that relates to the true position on this earth and that can someday be viewed on Google Earth just like other POI (Points of Interest) and data and can be “popped” up in a window with all the related names, pictures, coordinates, datum and system specification of that monument or virtual point on our globe as a Global Surveyor’s dream come true. How is that for a long sentence!!!!
It is time for surveyor’s to give up their narrow minded ways and contribute to this system, make an name for themselves to be pioneers and have points named after them to be used forever and for the better of the whole world’s economy and progess.
Nightmare Subdivisions for the land owner and surveyor
Over many years of experience in land surveying work with land owners, one has found some subdivision plats in the counties of Tulsa, Osage, Pawnee, Creek, and Rogers to be nightmares. The nightmare is revealed with attempts to plot the subdivision accurately. The math and geometry will not work and you are left with a challenge as to how to help the land owner find plot their lot boundary. Then you are faced with finding property corner evidence in the form of survey markers that match the original Plat of record. You can obtain the Subdivision Plat (Official Map Drawings with text of boundary details of whole and all the lots, etc.) at the County Clerk’s land office.
Here is a starter list of Nightmare Subdivision Plats:
PlatNo. - Name - City - County – State – Country
TC0795 - Garden Heights - Sand Springs - Tulsa - OK - USA more to be added. Digital copies of the Plats above and many others can be obtained with a $10 fee via PayPal to gary@gbreisch.com Send your list of Nightmare Subdivisions to gary@gbreisch.com or gbreisch@gmail.com and join the Coop to share this and other related information.
2011 in review
The WordPress.com stats helper monkeys prepared a 2011 annual report for this blog.
Here’s an excerpt:
A San Francisco cable car holds 60 people. This blog was viewed about 1,300 times in 2011. If it were a cable car, it would take about 22 trips to carry that many people.
Location Map of Your Land
HAVE GARY DO YOU A “DESCRIPTION MAP” OF YOUR LAND DESCRIPTION:
Do you have a good map of your property and really know where your property corners and lines are? Such services to help you can be found at www.gbreisch.com or search on the “gbreisch” name.
The first step to obtaining such a map is to contact me. Before most people can find precision property lines and corners, the description of the land should be “mapped.”
That description needs to be worded in such a way to be able to locate the land precisely. Ultimately it must have line distances and bearings (angular relationships to the lines or curves).
If your description or “legal description” describes a “Subdivision Name” with a Lot and/or Block number, then you only have a reference to a map or other description that has to be obtained in order to “find” what is needed.
TRS (Township Range Section) LOCATION MAP SERVICES:
If your description describes a part of a part, etc. of a section, then, of course, you need to locate the section with enough distances and bearings between the corners of the section to determine the parts. This can be simple to those familiar with sections or what might be better called “survey sections” I have gone into details about the way that Sections as a part of a TRS (Township Range Section)system are normally sized and arranged within a Township-Range grid.
A Section is often described by the general public as a “Square Mile.” In the many years since 1965 of working with surveying and sections, I have never see a precise Square Mile as a Section, in fact, many Sections that I have seen or surveyed have eight sides and all the sides have different bearings (directional angles) and distances.
I have been accumulating section information near to and outward from my home town in Sand Springs, Oklahoma for most of my life. I have a massive folder and file system that is arranged using the simple form of the TRS designation. Building a TRS map for a tract of land is one of may services I offer to Land Surveyors and direct to the public. Such services to help you can be found at www.gbreisch.com or search on the “gbreisch” name.
I either pull up a TRS and update it with information on a description provided by a client or build one from scratch. If the information is vague but enough to plot and use with other sources of map information such as historical map documentation such as aerial photos or Topography maps, then that is what is coordinated to create an approximate map of the subject tract of land.
“Description Map” SERVICES:
The more information that can be used to create such a “Description Map,” the better. This can be a lot of work but is very useful when “looking for evidence on the ground” to come off of for the more precision location of the subject land. It is the map that the novice through expert needs before visiting the site or venturing out to find the physical evidence to base the precision measurements and boundary location.
The “Description Map” with related files, archives, accounting and project set up starts at about $500 for most general public projects at 2011 prices. It costs a lot less to fellow surveyors because they require a fraction of the explanations, exhibits, and other information and instead, be able to transfer the information via CAD drawing as a service without the need for consulting, and explanations over the phone or via email typically needed by the general public. On projects only requiring these maps, and with quantity locations, the cost can be reduced proportional to the time and “mass production” aspects of the project.
THE “Description Map” VALUE:
With that Map, most people will take that map to their immediate neighbors and give them an opportunity to take part in the “hunt” to find survey markers near out outward from the subject property in order to tie down the map and proceed to the next step. Once two points are found on a line, other points can be found more easily. It is always better to find more than two points or corners, however, it is very common to find few markers for land further away from town, and is some counties, can be a big challenge resulting in a section survey that can cost thousands of dollars, even if it is a rural subdivision with a plat to use.
Some plats will not compute geometrically which can be very difficult to resolve with the little senior evidence available. Sometimes, as with the mapping process, one has to consider the physical evidence of roads, fences, and other features with variable ties to survey markers to build the map or boundary as intended by proportion or a combination of various units of evidence within a budget.
DO YOU NEED THE COST OF A BOUNDARY SURVEY?:
One cannot reasonably site confidence to what one does not know for sure or what cannot be obtained within the time and resources provided. As the land becomes more valuable and the need for agreement between adjoining land owners and evidence (documentation at the local County Clerk) is desirable.
It can be argumentative weather you really need to go to the expense of a Boundary Survey when all you may need is a “legal agreement” with the fellow boundary owners as to the location and survey markers that mark it. Is it all about evidence or is it the “procedure” that may have no respect to your budget or needs?
There is no doubt with over 40 years of experience with this subject that my services are of great value to reasonable people. Reasonable people usually want to understand the importance of having maps that show their land location. They also appreciate that the “Description Map” can provide them a basis of finding and showing evidence and providing more confidence in the understanding of their land ownership boundaries.
Naturally, surveyors would like to have an unlimited budget to provide Boundary Surveys that meet the minimum standards. The minimum standards provide a good template for a great Boundary Survey but can be overkill and kill the budget of the client these days. Sometimes the procedural aspects ignore the reasonable aspects of physical evidence at the project site in favor of remote evidence. The calculations that conflict with the sometimes vague or incorrect title documents can be very confusing for lands with few nearby and well done survey documentation.
MORE ABOUT THE “TRS” SYSTEM:
The TRS grid is numbered north and south by the name of Townships. In other words, the north or south number of the grid can only be the Township. I use a numbers system that excludes the name because the north or south designation means that it is a township designation so why waste space to say it is a Township when the number and direction is all you need. For example, I use 19N11E16 for the TRS of the Section that I reside.
The code name for the TRS that I use represents the least amount of characters needed to describe exactly the section that a property is described or anchored. The 11E in that code represents Range 11 East because Range numbers are either east or west. There are 36 sections in each Township-Range (TR) area. The drawing above shows the Township-Range grid. Each TR is about 36 square miles plus or minus. More about the specific meaning of “plus or minus” or “more or less” later to explain a very important class of descriptions. The “more or less” designation refers to the section subdivisions with this wording that has been misused for many years by attorneys, abtract companies, and surveyors due to a lack of understanding and use.
The below drawing represents the shaded area of the drawing above and shows a TR that is divided down into sections to complete the TRS system designation. All land surveys are based on the TRS system used by the County Clerk and County Assessor in each County of Oklahoma to locate boundaries and inventory ownership of land areas.
Township-Section Checkerboard
Notice that section 14 is shaded in the drawing above. Each section is approximately 1 square mile or 640 acres. You can truly say that each section is 640 acres more or less. So why do we say “more or less”? If you know the exact dimensions of the section then there is no need to say “more or less.” If you know the precise dimensions of any tract of land then you can describe it from the section corners to precisely locate it and determine the precise area and description of the tract. The precision dimensions are called “Metes” which is short for “measurements” provided by the land surveyor who measures the lines that make up a boundary of the tract of land being described. If a person has those Metes then the area can be calculated to the nearest decimal based on the precision of the survey line measurements. When the area is calculated using the measured sides of the tract, then there is no longer a need to describe the area and follow with the words “more or less” or “plus or minus”.
For example, the original surveyors set monument and references to them in the original surveys which, once set, were never supposed to be moved or changed. Those eight section corners around the section are the sides of the section and are supposedly been preserved and in the same position as originally set. Most savvy surveyors know that that is not the case with some of the sections corners we find these days in populated areas. Many of the original section corners where sandstones that were set in place originally, then later replaced with other types of monuments or survey markers that are common today, more than 100 years later. Can you imagine how many times that a county road worker wiped out a section corner that is usually at the intersection of common section line roads in Oklahoma?
Section corners have been wiped out or damaged at intersections and between those intersections because of the natural process and treaties of old times. Most section lines have “Statutory Right-of-Way” easements that allow access to by the public and/or government entities in Oklahoma established by treaties with the various tribal lands in Oklahoma. Statutory Right-of-Ways are not just exclusive to Oklahoma. The width of those easements are varied in Oklahoma and it takes a special map to determine them. I have yet to find a precision map that will allow me to zoom into the boundaries of each territory where the width changes. There is a need for a better definition. Few understand much about those easements and I have found no one that can help me pin down the boundaries precisely. It appears that that and many other points have been lost due to lack of maintenance in Oklahoma.
Below is an drawing illustration of a section breakdown and typical subdivision examples. The example shown below came from the shaded area of the drawing above. Each example I have shown starts from the larger to the smaller like using a magnifying glass and zooming in closer and closer to a tract of land.
Sample Breakdown or Subdivision of a Section
Unfortunately, the description of the tract within the section becomes more complicated and confusing unless you understand how to take a description and use it to plot the tract within the section as if the section was a perfect square mile. I have yet to find a section as a perfect square mile so at this point, you must understand that we are working with “more or less” until the section has been measured and logged for both distance and bearings.
The breakdown or subdivision of a section has not changed for the better since the beginning section descriptions. Many tracts of land are still described by “subdivision of a section” and are not considered “surveyed” even though the section was surveyed originally back in the 1800′s. So if your land is described as the 1/4 or 1/2 parts or other part descriptions elements, it most likely has not been surveyed precisely and there is really no way to locate it precisely without finding the survey markers for it or finding the survey markers from other surveys that will allow you to divide the section down to show the true distances and bearings. For those not familiar of what bearings mean, this can be complicated to explain in words. The old saying that “a picture is worth a thousand words” applies to this process.
Bearings are basically directions based on what is used for the North, East, South, or East direction. The North direction can be based on the direction of a shadow of the sun with a vertical line at its highest point in the sky. Most surveys that I see show North as an assumed plan direction shown on the Survey Drawing or “Plat of Survey” (POS). If a Survey Accurate GPS is used for the establishment of North, then all the bearings shown are considered “true” and accurate. “Due North” said or written does not necessarily mean True North. When early surveyors referenced “North” it could have been based on “Magnetic North” using a compass. A compass is subject to many factors that influence accuracy. Regardless of the basis of bearing, the surveyor would often measure angles to calculate bearings more precisely with instruments of higher precision to better describe the Metes for a POS. Nowadays, with SAGPS (Survey Accurate GPS) equipment, the True Bearings can be calculated by precision measurements without looking through a telescope or pulling out the tape measure.
North is UP on most maps and is shown on the best maps for orientation.
Please understand that the Bounds are more important than the Metes. Up to this point I have focused on the system that depends on the position of the original monuments and the measurement used to create a POS with a precise description of the tract of land. Many abstract and title companies locally have lost the experience and knowledge of the legal priorities of the TRS and Metes & Bounds (MB) system. I am not an attorney but I know one of the best land law attorneys in Oklahoma that agrees with me on the priority of Bounds. Few attorneys, abstract & title companies, County Clerks, County Assessors, Government Authorities and land surveyors understand the priority of Bounds for a MB description.
2010 in review
The stats helper monkeys at WordPress.com mulled over how this blog did in 2010, and here’s a high level summary of its overall blog health:
The Blog-Health-o-Meter™ reads Minty-Fresh™.
Crunchy numbers
A Boeing 747-400 passenger jet can hold 416 passengers. This blog was viewed about 1,300 times in 2010. That’s about 3 full 747s.
In 2010, there were 3 new posts, growing the total archive of this blog to 22 posts. There were 6 pictures uploaded, taking up a total of 290kb.
The busiest day of the year was December 9th with 32 views. The most popular post that day was Survey Accurate Data into Google Earth.
Where did they come from?
The top referring sites in 2010 were en.wordpress.com, tips-tools-tutorials.com, statistics.bestproceed.com, hoiantoday.info, and tryje.info.
Some visitors came searching, mostly for diy land surveying, diy land survey, google earth trs, sapulpa flood map, and diy surveying.
Attractions in 2010
These are the posts and pages that got the most views in 2010.
Survey Accurate Data into Google Earth October 2008
1 comment
New FEMA Maps May Have Your Home In A Flood Plain September 2009
1 comment and 1 Like on WordPress.com,
DIY Land Survey December 2009
Gary W. Breisch – Registered Land Surveyor – Oklahoma
Land Surveying Field Work SandSprings OK
GPS - excellent for a one man land survey crew
Land Survey Data Collection GPS Style
Pictures (& drawings) are worth at least a thousand words.
Helping home town folks find their property corners and easements so they and build in the correct areas.
Pipelines through a subdivision locations can be challenging and worth the effort for those who care to do things right.
LPG Pipeline right through a Sand Springs Subdivision
TOPO Precise and Cheap
Think TOPO – Think it Fast – Think it Modern – Think it Efficient – Think it Low Cost – Think it Multiple Use Data – New View Digital Mapping of Tulsa (NVDMT) and growing with Surveyors all over the World.
More than just an Image
Prices:
1) Digital topographic contour map (includes point data in DWG file format) from precision satellite laser scanning of the earth surface known as LiDAR that is processed into easy to view and use format.
• Aerial coordinated over a USGS quad sheet and aerial photograph
• 5′/10′ contour intervals
• Cropped to the size of the boundary map
• $1000 per 100 acre section. Multiple 100 acre sections are $1000 per section.
• Useful for general preliminary planning and watershed analysis or water resource management.
• Includes overview by Registered Land Surveyor and on-site High Precision Control Points with NAVD88, NAD83, and WGS84 coordinate data set and provided with DWG file format.
2) Digital topographic contour map (includes point data in DWG file format) from precision satellite laser scanning of the earth surface known as LiDAR that is processed into easy to view and use format.
• Aerial coordinated over a USGS quad sheet and aerial photograph
• 1′/2′ contour intervals
• Cropped to the size of the boundary map
• $1500 per 100 acre section. Multiple 100 acre sections are $1500 per section.
• Useful for engineering and design.
• Includes overview by Registered Land Surveyor and on-site High Precision Control Points with NAVD88, NAD83, and WGS84 coordinate data set and provided with DWG file format.
For above: 50% retainer required for all new client accounts is credited on invoice #1. Prices are based on payment within 14 days of invoice. The 14 day invoice payments are based on a discount of 30%. The 14 to 30 day discount is considered 50% discount. No discounts are given after 30 days of invoice date plus 2% interest averaged per month and calculated prorate per day after 30 days added on to invoice balance. If your budget requires other terms, please allow me to work with you on your special needs.
3) If you bring New View Digital Mapping of Tulsa a large project, such as the one being bid on for $80,000 then I will pay you a 5% commission. So, for example, based on an $80,000 project revenue and if you find a city or county that would need a large area mapped to integrate with their GIS system then I would have you refer them to me and I would work directly with them and upon completion of the project and receipt of payment you would be eligible for the 5% commission. I believe that, not only is the big money in these municipal projects, but I also believe the greatest need may be in this sector at this time as well.
If you research the cities and counties in your state I bet you will find that many do not have actual digital contour maps to integrate with their GIS systems and would like it but until now the cost has probably been prohibitive.
For those interested in more information, as a user of this kind of data or as a surveyor wanting to provide this service, please contact me for more information on how we can work together for our mutual benefit. Samples of projects are available for this low priced and high quality and precision mapping service provided by land surveyors all over the World.
Thanks,
Kyser Williams
New View Digital Mapping of Tulsa
AAdvanceLandServices@gmail.com
Samples and additional information can be accessed at:
http://www.gbreisch.com/gwb/client/NVDMT
DIY Land Survey
DIY Land Survey
Survey Accurate Data into Google Earth
No matter what you do, form a business and blog it so you can promote your life’s dreams and then you will see them come true instead of happen chance and disappointment. It is similar to my “Decide to be Happy” article at www.gbreisch.com and changing the way you think to make what you want happen and help others do the same to spread the good news.
SAGES POINTS at gbreisch radius
TRS grid overlay on Google Earth
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